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Supplements for Raw Food

This is a dedicated place for all of your questions and answers about Raw Diets. There are also some really cool groups like "Raw Fed" on the topic you can join. This forum is for people who already know they like the raw diet or sincerely want to learn more. Please remember that you are receiving advice from peers and not professionals. If you have specific health-related questions about your cat's diet, please contact your vet!

  


Member Since
04/06/2014
 
 
Purred: Sun Apr 6, '14 12:32am PST 
Hello Everyone,

This is my first post here. I have switched my guy kitty to mostly Rad Cat and Stella and Chewy, while my girl refuses to eat them for the most part. I had made my own raw food a few years ago but it didn't go over well and I gave up eventually. I wish I had found Rad Cat then or pursued this because I see how important it is for their overall health the more I read about it.

I used a recipe from Dr. Pitcairn's book - the grains/carbs, I want to feed them a purely raw and very lo or no carb diet at the moment. But I'm worried about what supplements to add as I was last time. I used chicken breast, chicken livers, butter, and 2 eggs. I had planned to grind the egg shells to add also for calcium but they were too wet.

I have looked at a few supplements online but they seem to have things like whey, pysllium husks and dried eggs which I don't want to include. Dr. P's recipe included these supplments: 10,000 iu vit e, 100-200 iu vitamin a and 500 milligrams taurine. I added in the taurine but not the other ingredients since I don't have them yet. Are they all essential? I will not be adding bone so I though to purchase Kal bone meal, but I was wondering if the phosphurus is too high in that to balance the calcium. I don't have a meat grinder and will most likely not be adding bone in myself. I notice that rad cat has nothing added into it and I assume that is due to having ground bone and organs? I'm not sure.

I also wonder if it is necessary to freeze the meat? I know this will kill any potential bacteria but it will also lessen the amount of taurine and perhaps make it less appealing and fresh? My boy is fiv+ and has early kidney/crf- I don't want him to possibly get bacteria although the two times I fed the fresh raw he was ok.

He loves Rad Cat but I can't get this realiably as the last time I ordered it from a local pet shop the delivery didn't come through. And I also like the idea of making my own fresh food a lot of the time- I'm hoping to convert his sister to this also. She did eat some of it earlier, but she is very finicky and needs a lot of variety.

I would like just one supplement maybe to add in but I can't find one I like. I have looked at feline instinct and tc Feline so far.

Thanks for you input!
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BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Sun Apr 6, '14 4:55am PST 
I use Dr. Pierson's recipe and order meat ground with bone and organs from Hare-Today. If you're just using ground meat without bone, you could try Alnutrin, which includes the supplements and calcium. BTW, don't be afraid of psyllium husks - that's just fiber and is not a problem. I don't see away around freezing - you can't make daily portions. I just add taurine to the ground for my cat that eats that recipe, but I don't add anything to BK's Frankenprey, I just make sure he has lots of variety in his proteins. Hope this helps!
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Member Since
04/06/2014
 
 
Purred: Sun Apr 6, '14 4:49pm PST 
Thanks BK,

I'm going to look up that one as well as that supplier. I get my meat from wholefoods I purchase bell and evans.

Do you partially cook the meat as Dr. Pierson says she does? I'm not sure what to do about that. I'm still a bit worried about salmonella etc. Will freezing kill off bacteria? I just read online that it won't kill salmonella. I have put the batch I made in the freezer for now, just in case. Rad cat is frozen but it's not cooked at all and I'm not sure about bacteria etc.

My guy has been on that for 3-4 weeks but no sign of salmonella etc. Are cats affected by that at all? One of my dvm said they're not as susceptible to it as we are. I believe though as Dr. Pitcairn says that the raw meat has more enzymes and nutrients like Taurine etc. and freezing may destroy that?

I still have so many questions.


http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_freezing_food_kill_un wanted_bacteria

Edited by author Sun Apr 6, '14 4:52pm PST

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BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Mon Apr 7, '14 4:38am PST 
I don't cook anything. There is more danger of your cat getting a harmful bacteria from dry food than there is from raw! Their digestive systems are designed for this - the food passes through quickly and the enzymes in their stomachs keep them protected from bacteria. Freezing does kill most bacteria but it's not known how much taurine or vitamins are lost in the process. That's why Dr. Pierson adds extra taurine to her recipe. In theory, there's plenty of taurine in dark poultry and red meat but she puts extra in case some is destroyed in the freezing process. Hope this helps.
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Member Since
04/06/2014
 
 
Purred: Thu Apr 10, '14 5:41pm PST 
Thanks Bk,

I did notice that Dr. Pierson says she now cooks the meat 20% due to bacteria though so I guess she is worried about bacteria. I'm not sure how to tell how much it is cooked though?

I did cook the first batch a bit and they seemed to like it that way. My boy has fiv so I do have to worry about him getting sick more.

I'm currently trying to deal with a very bad case of acne he has now, maybe from a contaminated stainless steel dish or the raised pet dishes I got to help his vomiting. I ordered some dishes from basic pets and will only use those now.

I think that my cats don't like egg added in and I'm wondering if it is ok to leave it out and if I should add something else in? Dr. Pierson mentioned this is ok since some cats just dont' like eggs... I will make a new batch tonight without egg and see what happens.

I also am a bit concerned that since I have switched my boy to raw he has had one severe ear infection and now very bad acne on his chin. I know there may be no correlation but obviously I have to consider it as a possible relationship.
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BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Fri Apr 11, '14 4:39am PST 
Are you grinding the Bell & Evans chicken? I'm unclear what you're feeding between that and the Radcat. If you're buying whole chicken pieces and grinding them yourself, I think you could dip the whole pieces in boiling water to kill any surface bacteria but I wouldn't cook them more than that because of the bone. I did lightly cook Dr. P's ground recipe when I first started - not because of bacteria but to transition my guys to raw. I would make small patties and heat them in a non-stick pan for a few seconds. Not really to "cook" them but to get a nice meat smell going.

BK is on a medication that suppresses his immune system and he's never had an issue with any raw. Which brings me to another point - those ear and acne problems are a red flag. My guess is that you're dealing with allergies like BK's. Doctors don't know why but ear problems go hand in hand with allergies. It's very hard to diagnose allergies - it's really a matter of eliminating everything else - but those ears are a clue. If your vet hasn't suggested this you might consider trying to find a dermatologist.

If you're interested in reading about BK's allergy story and our journey to raw, I did an article about it for ibdkitties.net: http://www.ibdkitties.net/Allergiesandraw.html

Last, regarding the egg, I would start out with a small amount of egg and increase it. I make a 6 pound batch of ground food at a time with 4 eggs. If I thought that they had a problem with the eggs I would start with 1 egg in a batch and if they ate it increase to two eggs in the next batch, etc.

Hope this helps!
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Wizard

1322972
 
 
Purred: Fri Apr 11, '14 7:07pm PST 
Thanks BK,

I'm just putting meat into a food processor so far, no bones, I don't have a grinder. I left out the egg and they seem to like that better so since dr. P and dr. Pitcairn both have eggless recipes I think I will stick with that instead. I will read your article, thanks! And maybe get him to a dermatologist if necessary. I'm not sure if this could be allergies because putting them on a raw, carb/grain free diet is supposed to help allergies. This all started after putting him on the raw diet, on rad cat in particular although it's hard to say. My next shipment of radcat came in so I will start that when the recent batch I made is finished.

I put bell evans breasts & chicken livers, sunflower oil, plenty of taurine, vit d, fish oil in so far. I'm still waiting for the other supplements to get here- I ordered them online. I may grind up some egg shells I steralized last night.

Btw, I bathed his acne with warm salt water and added some extra salt after and it seems much better today so far- nasty stuff. I think the antibiotic is kicking in too finally.

Edited by author Fri Apr 11, '14 7:10pm PST

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BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Sat Apr 12, '14 4:04am PST 
Sounds like you're doing great. I hope it is only acne - that's much easier to treat. Although allergies can come on at any time and may not be related to food. In any event you're well on your way. Best of luck and feel free to come back with more questions and let us know how it's going!
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