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Questions

This is a dedicated place for all of your questions and answers about Raw Diets. There are also some really cool groups like "Raw Fed" on the topic you can join. This forum is for people who already know they like the raw diet or sincerely want to learn more. Please remember that you are receiving advice from peers and not professionals. If you have specific health-related questions about your cat's diet, please contact your vet!

  
Ziggy

921344
 
 
Purred: Tue Jul 16, '13 10:20pm PST 
Iv been feeding raw for a month now. Ziggy will only eat chicken, turkey and chicken hearts. Anything else he turns his nose up and runs, including bones, liver and kidney, or if covered in can/hidden he throws it up.

Iv been feeding canned grain free friskeys in the morning to make up for the lack of bone, liver and kidney

QUESTION 1:

I would like to replace some of the canned with a ground meal, but not all those added vitamins as on cat-nutrition and cat-info. How does this sound:

37oz chicken Meat/hearts/fat/skin
5.6oz bone (thigh/neck)
2.8oz each liver and kidney
1-2 eggs lightly cooked
1-2 cups water [just to add more liquid to there diet]

All ground together and put in jars. making sure the liver, kidney and bones evened out. Also thinking of doing one with beef (chicken bones). Going to see how they like this before making a different type and bigger batch

The night meal would be cut up meat/heart, so i purposely made the bone/live/kidney higher to make up for the night meal. Id still offer it at times

QUESTION 2

Ziggy menus been, All mornings Canned then rotating through chicken, chicken hearts and turkey. That is the only meat he will try and he can do pieces about the size of a quarter/dollar coin.
Iv tried hiding liver, kidney and other red meats in his food everything he throws it up. But Iv gotten ground from hare-today and he ate it fine. He even ate the whole ground rabbit (fur and all mixture) he will not touch the rabbit chunks I bought though, first time I bough beef from the store he ate the chunks no problem, second time he refused them I hid it in canned, he threw it up.

How can I introduce these without him throwing up? I would like to get at least one other meat in his diet. He goes crazy for his chicken (breast or thigh) and his turkey (I cut up a whole turkey, he only will eat the meat)
Iv tried duck hearts, chicken necks, crushed chicken wings, Cornish bones, duck pieces, rabbit pieces, ground goat, ground quail, ground mutton, beef chunks,chicken feet no luck.

QUESTION 3
I was thinking 6oz meals/cat/day
Neither seems to eat too much, iv been feeding 3-4oz/cat each night but sometimes there seems to be too much wasted food. I feed around 8-9pm and clean it up when I get up in the morning 8-9am.
I'm just wondering if 3oz/meal would be enough.

Eskimojo is 18 pounds he should be around 16-17 pounds, hes not very active
Ziggy's 12 pounds and a bit more active.


One things for sure EskimoJo is more playful and has lost a little weight that iv been trying to get rid of for around 3+ years, even tried prescription diet food he did not like (but ate).
He also does not charge into the bathroom (there feeding room) every time someone walks back there and act like he's starving even though he had food (EVO which he loved).
He truly surprised me he is the one I thought I would have a problem with, not ziggy. Ziggy has always liked meat, EskimoJo would never touch it. Ziggy was always the adventurous one who wanted to try new foods.

I will keep trying as they already seem happier.

So sorry for the long post
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Toby

Raw fed &- polydactyl!
 
 
Purred: Wed Jul 17, '13 4:52am PST 
"Iv been feeding raw for a month now. Ziggy will only eat chicken, turkey and chicken hearts. Anything else he turns his nose up and runs, including bones, liver and kidney, or if covered in can/hidden he throws it up.

Iv been feeding canned grain free friskeys in the morning to make up for the lack of bone, liver and kidney"

----

Here's the thing -- you are adding raw meat to a canned diet which is already balanced. This is creating imbalance. **You cannot balance raw meat with a balanced diet of canned.**

If your cat refuses to eat bone/organs, you need to stop feeding so much raw meat (have it be no more than 15% of the diet) to stop imbalance issues, or find a way to supplement the raw meat that your cat will tolerate. Have you tried ground eggshells as a calcium replacement, and grinding the organs or freezing them? Some cats will take to different textures/temperatures.

Edited by author Wed Jul 17, '13 4:53am PST

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BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Wed Jul 17, '13 5:26am PST 
True, you can't balance the raw with canned, but I assume this is just a short term measure until you come up with a solution.

You may want to consider just serving the ground from H-T for both meals since they're eating it. Get any one ground with bones and organs and add some chunked meat to it. (I add 1 lb. of meat to 5 pounds of ground.) What do you have against the vitamins? I would at least add taurine if not the others.

Ziggy may have some food intolerances that are causing the vomiting. Try single small pieces, and if he doesn't throw up go to two pieces, etc. I just wouldn't feed anything he throws up more than once.

3 oz. is a medium/large serving but if they're not screaming for food it may be enough even though they're large cats. The thing about raw is that it's very satisfying to them so they may eat less.

One other thing you might consider is using plain ground meat with a supplement like Alnutrin which supplies everything bones and organs would normally. Just a thought.
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Merlin - An Angel- Forever

*Poof*
 
 
Purred: Wed Jul 17, '13 9:20am PST 
Would a pre-mix make things easier? It's a vitamin/mineral powder mix that you add to ground/chopped raw meats. TC Feline, Better In The Raw, and Alnutrin are three brands. You can use whatever raw meats your cat likes.

6 oz per meal is a lot. Yes ,definitely feed less raw food per meal to avoid waste. 3 oz is still a lot of food. Try 1 oz per meal. If the cats eat it up right away and are still hungry, you can add another half oz or so until the cats are full. It shouldn't take a lot of raw to fill up a cat.
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BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Wed Jul 17, '13 2:31pm PST 
Gee Merlin, we seem to be saying the exact same things all the time, mol. I'm pretty sure she meant 6 oz per day which is not that much, in our house anyway. And those are some big cats!
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Merlin - An Angel- Forever

*Poof*
 
 
Purred: Thu Jul 18, '13 4:39am PST 
Mol, BK laugh out loud 6 oz per day still seems a lot to us. Leroy eats 3 oz per day and Emma only 2 oz per day. But they're not large cats shrug Leroy's pretty thin, probably those Aby genes and always running around like a nut laugh out loud, and Emma looks large but she just has a lot of floofy fur.

I guess with some cats you just have to try different amounts of food to see how much they will eat at a time and not get hungry shortly afterwards smile
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Ziggy

921344
 
 
Purred: Mon Jul 22, '13 8:14pm PST 
yes sorry 3oz/cat/meal

I do have some bone meal I had bought. I sprinkle some on ziggys meat (tiny bit) every once in a while. But cannot find how much bonemeal I would use per meal? As I already have the meals proportioned and frozen I would need to do it per meal or every few meals. I scooped some of EskimoJo's ground duck up with a little bone meal and Ziggy took to it. He seems to like the smell/taste of Bone meal.

Till I get him to eat bones, kidney and liver I'm feeding more can and natures Variety raw chicken to ziggy. But they seem to be preferring raw more then can now days. Where they use to eat all the can with in a hour there is usually some left by the next feeding. Then all the raw meal is eaten.

For the recipe on cat-nutrition if I followed that {except the salmon oil, Ziggy will not touch fish) would i need to take out any of the added vitamins if I used kidney. I do have tons of kidney and would like to use it in the homemade ground.
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Kaylee

I'm a cute,- walking ball of- fur!
 
 
Purred: Mon Jul 22, '13 9:45pm PST 
I agree with the comment about a slower transition. Maybe go back to serving 80-90% canned food with a tiny bit of raw (few chunks of chicken/turkey/organs). Slowly transition the total amount every day.

Another idea is what I did with my dog. I sliced or chopped up small pieces of organs, mixing it well with other meats, especially with his favorite foods (eggs, sardines, pork). Then I sprinkled cheese on it. I wouldn't use cheese on Ziggy's but find something he really, really enjoys to mix with. Remember, organ meat is very rich and takes a longer time to transition than muscle meat. Mix it well and maybe even puree it with a blender. There are cat foods with gravy that may help with this.

I use TCFeline with my cats. I make sure the liver is chopped up really small and blended well. They even sell a pre-mix that includes liver, which may be easier to do.

Edited by author Mon Jul 22, '13 9:46pm PST

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BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Tue Jul 23, '13 4:04am PST 
I wouldn't worry about taking out the vitamins when you add kidney - just don't add more than 5%. The only vitamin that isn't flushed from their system is vitamin A which is found in liver.

Sounds like they're taking to it - congrats!
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