GO!

Switching to Raw food (cats wont eat)

This is a dedicated place for all of your questions and answers about Raw Diets. There are also some really cool groups like "Raw Fed" on the topic you can join. This forum is for people who already know they like the raw diet or sincerely want to learn more. Please remember that you are receiving advice from peers and not professionals. If you have specific health-related questions about your cat's diet, please contact your vet!

  
(Page 1 of 2: Viewing entries 1 to 10)  
Page Links: 1  2  
KC

the princess
 
 
Purred: Fri Jun 3, '11 10:55am PST 
i have 3 cats that i am trying to switch to the raw food diet using the fasting method. i did a week of reducing the food by half and offering the raw food as well. and since i managed to get my middle cat (sonny) nibbling at the raw food and my youngest cat (lyra) eating straight raw beef liver (wont touch the mix) i decided to remove the dry food all together in hopes that my oldest (kc) would try the food if the dry stuff wasnt there to distract her(also i had run out of dry food). i removed the dry food last night. and managed to get her to take a few licks off the spoon i used to portion the food out with. but she wont eat from the bowl. or try the plain liver.

she is loosing a fair bit of weight. (started out overweight) and im worried she might starve herself.

i am planning to buy a variety of meats tonight to see if i can just find a type of meat that she likes. and im ging to try mixing the raw meat with some canned for my youngest cat (lyra). but since kc HATES all forms of wet food i dont know what to do to get her to eat the raw meat.

does anyone have any ideas on how to get the raw food to appeal to her?

p.s. i use home made raw food consisting of 90% meat (80% ground chicken with 20% liver) 10% veggies(pumpkin) 1 tsp ground eggshells per pound of meat and 2 Cod liver oil capsules per pound of meat.

i warm the food in a ziplock bag that i put in a bowl of warm water before i serve it.

also i have a dog on a similar diet (except 75%meat to 25% veggies) and he switched over amazingly.
[notify]

Shade

My name is not- Kittyfloss!
 
 
Purred: Sun Jun 5, '11 4:55am PST 
Please, please, please don't fast your cats. Cats can get hepatic lipidosis, or fatty liver disease, from not eating anything at all, sometimes for even only a day.

For cats that are addicted to dry food, it is best to try to convert them to canned food before going with the raw, unless of course you are lucky enough to get one that does the immediate switch.

Catinfo.org has a whole section on converting cats from kibble to canned and raw foods. Please check that out. I think that ibdkitties.net also has a section on converting from kibble to canned.

The recommended raw diet for a cat consists of 80% muscle meat, 10% bone, 5% liver, and 5% other secreting organ. IMHO your homemade recipe could use a bit of tweaking. Where did you get that recipe from? Is it just a converted dog recipe? The pumpkin is not necessary unless your cats are having elimination problems. Cats are obligate carnivores and have no vegetable requirement in their diet, despite what so many commercial cat food companies would have you believe. Also, you really need to try to get some real bone into the diet eventually. Eggshells will work for a while though. Too much liver will give cats loose stools, so watch out for that as I think there might be a bit too much in your recipe. Additionally, you need to try to add something like pancreas, kidneys, or sweetbreads into the diet for that "5% ohter secreting organ". If you like,, you can look at the recipe on catnutrion.org.

How did KC like the other meats that you bought? Some cats just aren't too thrilled with chicken.

Best of luck!

Purrs,
Shade
[notify]

KC

the princess
 
 
Purred: Mon Jun 6, '11 2:52pm PST 
i got my general recipe from http://animalhomeopathy.org.tripod.com/www.animalhomeopathy.org/id19 .html

and i cant remember what website suggested i use the fasting method.

oh and i was planning to use a mix of various different organ meats (not all liver) but the store was sold out. but i have a better variety now.

also i should have mentioned the ground chicken i bought is ground necks and backs so it actually includes bone in the meat im just adding the eggshells to be sure that they are getting enough calcium (should i not be adding it?)

also found out my kittens were very sneaky .. they had a stash of dry food (from a brand of food i havent bought in quite a while) hidden away in a pile of clothes i was going to be donating.

another discovery i made while giving kc her taste test, was that:
1)lyra prefers it when i add some gravy from a can of wet food to the meat
2)sonny and lyra love the organ meat the best (especially gizzards and hearts)
3) they all hate bacon (it works well for a friend of mine)
3)when kc finally gave in to the food (just today actually) it was after i added a can of fancy feast and 2 cans full of water to the food mix. (i portioned my recipe into daily amounts so thats added to enough food for all 3 cats for the whole day. and then i portioned it out into servings)

p.s. i am VERY new with this type of diet so any further suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
[notify]


Shade

My name is not- Kittyfloss!
 
 
Purred: Tue Jun 7, '11 4:08am PST 
Hi again KC. The link you supplied didn't work, but I checked out some of the rest of the Happy Cats site (http://essentials4all.org/Happy_Cats_.html); is that the same site? With all due respect, I think that most of us here would disagree with what this guy is stating. Is this the Basic recipe that I found?

"My basic recipe is 75 to 90 percent raw meat, poultry or fish, and 25 to 10 percent finely ground raw or steamed/mashed vegetables. The recommended breakdown of the meat and vegetables is 35 percent muscle meat, 20 percent organ meat, 20 percent fat, and 25 percent vegetable. The breakdown for the 85/15 combination is 45 percent muscle meat, 20 percent organ meat, 20 percent fat, and 15 percent vegetable."

25% raw or steamed vegetables? 20% organ meat? He doesn't believe in feeding bone. As I mentioned earlier, cats are obligate carnivores, they have absolutely no dietery requirement for vegetables, especially not 25% of their diet. I personally would disregard most of what this guy is saying.

Please read catinfo.org, catnutrition.org, rawfedcats.org, and ibdkitties.net.

If the ground chicken you are feeding is made solely from ground necks and backs then you are feeding too much bone. The percentages for a raw diet should be 80% muscle meat, which by the way includes gizzards and hearts, these are not considered organs for raw feeding, 10% bone, 5% liver, 5% other secreting organ. A whole chicken is about 30% bone. Backs and necks have way more bone than a whole chicken, so you are feeding a whopping huge percentage of bone. Too much bone causes constipation, too much organ meat causes loose stool, so there is a reason for the balanced percentages in the diet.

You do not need to add the eggshells with the ground meat you are using. Can you mix the ground necks/backs with just plain ground chicken or turkey meat to cut the bone down?

It is common when switching cats over from a canned food diet to a raw diet to have to put some enticements on to the raw food, so you putting some canned food on top of the raw to get them to eat is a good step.

Again, please don't allow any of your cats to go too long without eating or you might risk feline health problems.

Purrs,
Shade
[notify]

Alex (sweet- angel girl)

Angel on a- mission!
 
 
Purred: Tue Jun 7, '11 9:46am PST 
Thank goodness Shade came in on this. That is the absolute wrong way to go about switching any pet's diet and any website that says to fast your cat is DANGEROUS!!! You're risking your cat's health and can cause fatty liver disease in a matter of 48 hours of not eating. Please please please read this information. Shade gave you great info and I'm going to add to that. Here's my website and first I'll give you the page on fatty liver and how easy it is to develop that and how dangerous it is: http://ibdkitties.net/fattyliver.html. Now I'll give you a GREAT page that a few of the moms here on Catster wrote on my site about how to feed raw. They are very knowledgeable and this is the proper way to go about it: http://ibdkitties.net/rawinstructions.html. And I also have a page on how to switch foods NICE AND SLOW AND SAFELY: http://ibdkitties.net/switchingfoods.html.

I'm in no way getting mad at you sweetie, I'm ticked majorly at that stupid website! Ugh! By putting things like that up there, they endanger cats to end up like me, dead!

Please read those pages and all of us here will be more than happy to help you in any way we can okay? We LOVE that you're trying to feed them raw, if it doesn't work though, you can't force them and by doing so, you can cause serious health risks.

Hang in there, we'll figure this out! way to go
[notify]

Olivia,- Tanner, &- Finn

The Dyna Cats!
 
 
Purred: Tue Jun 7, '11 10:10am PST 
Welcome to the raw forum! I see some others have already started helping you out, which is great, and I'm so glad you found this forum, because this could have gone terribly wrong very very quickly!

First of all, and I know others have covered this already, but I just want to say it again - you never EVER fast a cat, unless under specific instructions from your veterinarian prior to surgery or something similar. It's super dangerous, and can cause far more problems than it will solve. This is especially true when you have a kitty that is overweight - they are at very real risk of winding up with hepatic lipidosis.

Secondly - cats don't need veggies, pumpkin, etc. And if I am reading your other posts correctly, the mix you are feeding already has bone in it and you are adding eggshells to that? That is too much bone/calcium. Bone is only 10% of the overall diet - think of it like ten cents out of a dollar. It's not much. And too much is just as bad, or worse, as not enough.

I think you need to take a few steps back and really slow down here. If your cats are still addicted to dry food, try weaning them onto grain free canned food first, and then from there to raw.

Also, please check out http://ibdkitties.net/rawinstructions.html for some in-depth instructions on what a proper prey model diet consists of, and how to go about switching.
[notify]

BK

Ambassador at- the Kitty U.N.
 
 
Purred: Tue Jun 7, '11 11:33am PST 
Welcome KC! We're so glad you're here, I think we all just panicked a little when we saw some of the things that website recommended to you. I think that everyone here covered the basics, but I just want to add that you should never feed kibble and raw within 12 hours of each other - the kibble takes so long to digest that the raw can get backed up behind it and grow bacteria.

I'm not surprised that all the cats aren't taking to raw. I've had fosters come in who do not even recognize meat as food because their whole lives they've only had processed cat food. It can be a long, slow process and you can't make them change by fasting them until they're ready.

I hope you'll take a good look through all the sites we've mentioned. There's a lot to learn to feed raw correctly and although we're thrilled to have another raw member we want your cats to all be healthy and happy!
[notify]

Brandy

Brandy "Burning- Curiosity"
 
 
Purred: Tue Jun 7, '11 2:34pm PST 
Try keeping out all the veggies, cats dont need them and are not even made to digest them. Check out this website for information about feeding you cat. http://www.catinfo.org/#Home-Prepared_Diets

My cats tried to refuse to eat it at first too but I only offered that to them and they started eating it once they realized every time they begged for food, id put down the raw for them. They didn't starve themselves, maybe try stop mixing it with their old food.
[notify]

Brandy

Brandy "Burning- Curiosity"
 
 
Purred: Tue Jun 7, '11 2:34pm PST 
Try keeping out all the veggies, cats dont need them and are not even made to digest them. Check out this website for information about feeding you cat. http://www.catinfo.org/#Home-Prepared_Diets

My cats tried to refuse to eat it at first too but I only offered that to them and they started eating it once they realized every time they begged for food, id put down the raw for them. They didn't starve themselves, maybe try stop mixing it with their old food.
[notify]

KC

the princess
 
 
Purred: Wed Jun 8, '11 11:40am PST 
upon reading the everyone's responses one thing became very obvious to me. i have absolutely no idea what im doing.

i was only adding the eggshells because i guess i didnt quite realize that the ground meat contained bone because when i first started buying the ground meat(to feed my dog) i didnt know that you actually could put bones through a grinder. but i know now so i wont be adding any more eggshells to my pet food.

also thank you for letting me know that i dont need to add vegetables to my food. i should have clued in myself .. it didnt really make much sense.

it seems all my pets are eating the raw stuff now .. tho they arent eating as much as i thought they would. they all come running when the food gets put down now. oh and i have been using a trick i read about in another topic on this forum(putting the food bowls on a cold pack) so that they have more time to eat.

also about the muscle meat/ bone/ organ ratio .. i think i need some help with that..like .. i can order the necks and backs either chopped
ground or whole should i maybe order it chopped or whole so i can better control the bone level? and what do you think the ratio of the ground meat im buy at the moment is, because maybe i can just add enough gizzards and hearts to my current ground meat to get it to the right level of meat to bone percentage.

as for the organ meat i can easily find beef and chicken livers at my local grocery store, but my local butcher doesn't sell any organ meat at all. do you have any idea on where i can find organ meats other than liver?

i think i need to mention that one of my big reasons for switching to the raw meat diet is because i had read that it was cheaper than the really good pet food that i couldn't afford (as of a few months ago i could only afford the cheap crappy pet food like whiskas and beneful) and i could see the cheaper food wasnt healthy for my pets. so i thought i should mention that i dont have much in the ways of funds at the moment .. also that i dont drive so my options are limited to my local area.

i would like to thank everyone who has offered me their input so far and would greatly appreciate anymore help that may be available to me.

p.s. is there a place i can find a idiots guide to raw feeding? because it really does seem i have no clue.
[notify]

  (Page 1 of 2: Viewing entries 1 to 10)  
Page Links: 1  2